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Accueil » news » forums » Space Empires V » Space Empires V General

No patches anymore?

Soumis par lochkartenman le Mar, 2008-02-19 02:35 Space Empires V General

Hi!

I'm just a bit puzzled but where have the patches gone? It seems to that the latest patch is already a bit dated. It would be nice to have some definitive statement about when to expect the next update. In the past there were these nice beta change logs that served as some sort of teaser and kept the interest alive, but even a beta log is missing...

I am aware that the most urgent issues have been fixed but there is still much room for improvements, in my opinion:
- custom unit types
- retrofitting units and weapon platforms
- user interface decluttering
- saving list layouts outside of save games
- in-game formations editor
- in-combat change of ship/unit strategies and formations
- make mounts applicable to shields and other components
- area of effect damage type
- new property for weapons: BURST (salvo of X shots, Y seconds delay, another salvo)
- ...

Arne

‹ Display older components Space Simulator bug, wrong trait description / Racial Trait bug ›
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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Juju le Mar, 2008-02-19 02:47

You can save your list layouts with your empires Smiling

( I found that out recently, when I restarted a singleplayer game multiple times because of some wrong settings )
the downside is your research is saved with your empire, for no reason i can understand Smiling

so my suggestion is : Create your Empire, start a game, set your layots, save your empire, edit your empire to reset your research ( in this case it should only be starting colonisation ) and save.

curse when the next patch is out and you can't load your old empire file Laughing out loud

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Juju le Mar, 2008-02-19 04:51

unrelated to my other reply ..

retrofitting of units ( aka fighters, sats, wps, troops )
i think its a design decission from MM to make it not possible
( a mod would be cool though )

define custom unit types please Smiling

- make mounts applicable to shields and other components
afaik there are mods working on it ..
but imho it overloads the game and the AI can cope even less

area of effect damage type
new property for weapons: BURST (salvo of X shots, Y seconds delay, another salvo)
again a design decission .. me thinks .. but i would like them both Smiling
but then again .. isn't burst exactly what happens whenn you put lots of weapons on a ship ^^

- user interface decluttering
- in-game formations editor
- in-combat change of ship/unit strategies and formations

this i second without saying anymore

wait .. I got two more Smiling

- zoom out in tactical combat ( the one feature that made supreme
commander fun for a while .. total oversight of the battlefield )
- add the view settings from tactical combat to the sector view
( anyone else gets upset when trying to find some sats and mines, while trying to set up a good formation in a sector ? )

done ..

edit :

ps Smiling one more

- the launch options in tactical combat should be easier to handle and then
SHOULD BE EXECUTED !!!!111111!!!!

*rages* i can turn off autolaunch all I want, my carriers keep on spewing out all their fighters,
burning up supplies like crazy, going gun-ho! after some measly little satellite that took a wrong turn left .. *heaves* .. yeah .. so..

i got another while raging Smiling

I want unit formations, fighter wings and mech stars, so they take formation before running off like women with unlimited credit in an clothes store ..
( and i can finally differentiate between my interceptors and bombers )

and i want the "one-turns-worth" building option back .. i know i can take just one unit and turn on repeat .. but i liked the option

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par LordDemon le Mar, 2008-02-19 05:52

I agree on Area effect weapon and the burst model weapon. Burst model might even be quite easy to code. They don't need to be in the game, the possibility of using them in mods would be enough for me.

As for unit upgrade, I don't really need it, but since weapon platforms have the "can be upgraded" possibility, maybe they could do with a interface to be able to use it.

As for the other stuff, I'd much rather see some bugs fixed then icing on the cake. I still occationally see the ordnance/supply bug with launched satellite/fighter/drone groups. Drone ramming has a bug in it, much like they had in ship capture pods earlier; they aim at the default height. If target is above that height, then the drones just run circles under them. The combat simulator won't let you place the vehicles for some reason, I think this might be some sort of added feature gone bad.

Havent checked recently, but the black hole was buggy earlier. It caused 5000 pts worth of damage/ship instead of instant kill. I think this came after the components got boost in their durability, so it is likely an oversight. Simply multiplying the damage by 10 or 100 would cover it.

But I'm confident these things will be worked on eventually. So no need to worry, I'm sure Aaron can use a break from work every now and then too. He'll be back eventually, with new version. Maybe he just want´s to get more done in one update, as he is running out of version numbers below 2. Sticking out tongue

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Juju le Mar, 2008-02-19 06:04

I don't use ship capture and drones .. so i haven't noticed yet,
but its nice to know, because i thought about revamping drones in some kind of huge ship to ship missiles Smiling

Remember : Pillage! then burn.
- Cpt. Kaff Tagon

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Vince278 le Mar, 2008-02-19 13:00

No patches anymore?!? The game wouldn't be Space Empires without the endless series of patches! Laughing out loud

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par lochkartenman le Mar, 2008-02-19 13:57

@ Juju (no offense intended)

I still think that retrofitting of units would be a good idea. I understand than in some scenarios it might overpower units (especially fighters) but this might be different in other cases. For me it's a valid measure to reduce mirco-management and as such is generally a good thing. Modders should have control over consts and certain requirements, though.

I don't see what "design decision" could possibly stand against burst fire and area of effect weapons. For me both properties are a means to fine-tune weapon balance and are as such a good thing to have.

@ all

One more thing: I would like to see ship yards that are limited to a maximum ship size. Or even better: orbital ship yards would allow production of the bigger ships but would only contriubute a small building rate. This could give some cool strategical depth.

Whatever Aaron is brewing at the moment I would very much appreciate some proof of live.. Smiling

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Astroshak le Mar, 2008-02-19 15:45

For the burst weapons, is there any way to, say, code a weapon so it uses 1 (very short) delay for 2, 3, or 4 shots, then a larger (much larger depending on the weapon) delay before starting the cycle over? Or is the weapon delay a single value?

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par LordDemon le Mar, 2008-02-19 15:48

I think units in theory can be retrofitted, as there is a "can be retrofitteds" property units can have.(Weapon platforms have it). The problem is the lack of user interface to get to them, and order them to retrofit.

If interface was available, modders could use it to retrofit any unit.

But as I said, I have faith in Aaron. The guy has been working with the game for a long time, and I'm not in rush. Patience is a required virtue when playeing SEV, so why not when waiting for patches...

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Mod Designer

Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Fyron le Mar, 2008-02-19 16:16

Don't worry kids, the game isn't done yet.

lochkartenman wrote:
I don't see what "design decision" could possibly stand against burst fire and area of effect weapons. For me both properties are a means to fine-tune weapon balance and are as such a good thing to have.
Burst fire is a little harder to see, but area effect weapons would require quite a bit of new complicated math-work to get working right. When there are a lot of existing bits of code that are broken, such things take a back-burner to fixing what is already there.


SpaceEmpires.net | Space Empires Wiki

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Mod Designer

Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Fyron le Mar, 2008-02-19 16:18

...

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Juju le Mer, 2008-02-20 03:21

@lochkartenmann
no offense taken, I like the idea of retrofitting units,
all I said it could be a design decission which means nothing more
than MM decided on one point or another in the design process of
SE:V that it will not be possible to retrofit units or the damagetypes you mentioned, i don't think the even thought of burstfire, but from what i read so far area damage is an ongoing discussion .. and the arguments for the decission you are asking for
are
- do we like it ?
- can we do it ?
- can we do it in time ?

and thats just reason, i never said i like the decission, i only state that someone decided to do it this way. a very important and
usually a very early step in software design Smiling ( or any design at all )

about retrofitting fighters i think it will make them weaker, not stronger Smiling
the added management of ferrying them not only to your fleet, but also back to a space yard planet to be retrofitted, and then back,
maybe with backup fighters for the time being will add a whole new level of organisation and logistic

on the other hand, if you got a spaceyard present with your fleet, it renders your fighter useless for at least one turn

Remember : Pillage! then burn.
- Cpt. Kaff Tagon

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Juju le Mer, 2008-02-20 03:26

p.s. wouldn't it be fun, if MM published a SE:V Designer Kit with
some nice pieces of sourcecode to play with Smiling

Remember : Pillage! then burn.
- Cpt. Kaff Tagon

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par lochkartenman le Mer, 2008-02-20 05:02

Hey, SOURCE CODE that's it! Groovy baby! If only MM would decide to provide the source (for a limited audience) the number of developers working on the project could be increased quite a lot (one additional developer would be a 100% increase...).
I am aware that such a step is not easily made as - after all - the game is a commercial product and one can't expect it to become open source but nevertheless a carefully selected number of dedicated indidviduals could boost the progress significantly.

I don't know how the source is structured but if possible one could consider to only release part of the program to outside developers (e.g selected fans), such as the user-interface. Providing only the header files would be possibly sufficient to build a brand new interface that could be then "plugged" in by Aaron. I mention the UI because I think it is the part of the game that is best overhauled in very close collaboration with a broad fan base - something that apparently did not took place in the development process.

I know that this might be an quite harsh shift in business policies but for a company as small as MM it might be the only possibility to succeed.

comments please!

Regards
Arne

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Juju le Mer, 2008-02-20 05:30

Yeah.
I actually thought of an enhanced package of SE:V to pay for.
Hence the name Developer Kit, or maybe we should call
it SE:5 Developer Edition Smiling

Remember : Pillage! then burn.
- Cpt. Kaff Tagon

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Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Greystar le Mer, 2008-02-20 11:57

I'd rather see a game speed increase patch. Since about Turn 100 each NPC turn to process has taken longer and it only seems to be getting worse. I realize if there is combat between empires it'll slow things down a bit, but come on having to wait for about 1 minute for each NPC to process its turn (probably exagerating a tiny bit probably more like 30 seconds) would be anywhere from 11 minutes (I have 11 other NPCs in game) to 6 minutes. Then the end of turn process takes about 2 minutes. So SOMETHING to increase spead. I'm running on a 2ghz machine with 1gig ram it shouldn't be this slow. I'm guessing its because there are alot of units and ships moving, but still this game needs a major speed boost!!!

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Image de Arkonide

Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Arkonide le Mer, 2008-02-20 16:37

Greystar wrote:
...about 1 minute for each NPC to process its turn (probably exagerating a tiny bit probably more like 30 seconds) would be anywhere from 11 minutes (I have 11 other NPCs in game) to 6 minutes. Then the end of turn process takes about 2 minutes. So SOMETHING to increase spead.

You are lucky! I'm playing in turn 80, with 13 AI empires. Turn processing takes about 15 minutes, including the time when the turn begins and I have to wait for my ships to move. It is getting worse every turn, so it will be even worse in turn 100. My computer is basically like yours.

I think I will start another game, with half the number of AI empires.

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Image de Psieye

Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Psieye le Jeu, 2008-02-21 07:50

3 (non-mutually exclusive) options:
1) Play simultaneous turns.
2) Multitask with browsing the internet, etc
3) Play a Team game with no Neutral empires. Then you won't have much inter-NPC combat.

Take it as an anecdote, but when playing multiplayer games (especially across different timezones) it's not too strange to only get 1 turn done per day.

---Sig---
Playing Touhou games (Go to this Wiki if interested. No, nobody else is that good/insane as that replay). No rush for SE

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Image de Ashbery76
Mod Designer

Re: No patches anymore?

Soumis par Ashbery76 le Jeu, 2008-02-21 08:37

I agree about the turn times.In SEIV the game was pretty fast with 16 empires on large maps.SEV biggest flaw is how slow the game is.

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