Alliances: Good and Bad?

I started an alliance in one mature game I was playing against the AI.

I would say: be very careful when you join/create one. All of your current treaties will be canceled, and replaced by the Alliance, and as far as I could figure out, I couldn't create any alliances with other non-alliance organizations (as myself which makes sense, or as the Alliance).

This means that if you have a bunch of trade going on, you'll suddenly lose it. Likewise, neutrality pacts may cause a few conflicts (which will in turn spike relations to certain empires).

Just be aware of what you're getting into.

An Alliance simply merges all the diplomatic activities of its member empires. As a member, you have the security of being in an exclusive trading group etc. No member can maintain treaties outside of the Alliance, so there's less chance they are up to sneakiness. Non-members have to deal with the Alliance as a single entity, so it's more likely to discourage them from declaring war or abusing one of the members etc.

Space Empires Depot | SE:V Balance Mod

I haven't played multiplayer yet, so all I can speak about is single player games. Do not enter into an alliance with an AI empire! I did this and basically lost control of my empire, extremely limiting my gameplay. I thought this would be like an alliance on the old game, Star Trek: BOTF (yes, I am old). Wrong. I am thinking about trying a 2 human empire game against all of the AI empires with me controlling both human empires and entering into an alliance with myself. Might be a fun and interesting experience.

"We are the Vahl, resistance is...welcomed"

In a 13 AI plus 1 human game, I managed to set the conditions of my Alliance called the "United Federation" with the Phong early on since I won the political votes. It was a full Mutual Defense Pact with everything shared (including migration) except colonizing each other's systems. I changed the voting power to just one vote per empire, and by 2402.3 I had managed to politically maneuver a total of 12 AI empires into the Alliance. Now the game is just the one United Federation Alliance vs the remaining AI holdout that recklessly declared war on the Federation after its membership failed by one vote.

As the turns progress into 2404, I'm beginning to doubt the success of the United Federation as now I have factions of members voting to remove other factions of members, but so far no one has been removed because there is always a slim majority holding the Alliance together, and none seem to like my proposals to change the status quo. My hope was to unite all 13 AI empires and myself into an alliance, to see if that would end the game that way...but so far no luck. That lone holdout seems to not be liked by an increasing majority of the AIs in the Federation, and the sabre rattling is producing fruit as I see Federation fleets massing in the territory of Federation AIs closest to the lone holdout. I am almost tempted to play that lone AI holdout, but had hoped for a peaceful uniting of the galaxy at game start.

Has anyone ever gotten all AI empires to join an alliance and end the game that way without the loss of a single empire?

Yes, I got multiple AI empires to join the United Federation alliance. As soon as I accepted a new member, the new member would propose another member in the next turn or two, and it kept growing.

I wasn't able to get the lone hold out to join the Federation because the members would keep voting against it, but in a new game I started, I got all 5 AIs and myself into the Federation, and the game still continued until I gave up exploring it. Apparently "allied" victory isn't a game winning condition, even if all players in a game are in the same alliance.

Space Empires Wiki

Hey Inigma,

Did you change the victory conditions on game creation? I think you can make it as one of the victory conditions, but I dont think it is standard. It may of course just not work properly.

-Unnamed

Unnamed Mod

Wow. I saw this game in Target, I believe, years ago... a year ago? And said... "Looks like Moo 2, woohoo!" however, at the time I didn't have the cash to get it, and have been playing other RTS/Strategy games. When I had Moo2 I owned no three copies, and never could get it to work mulitplayer of the LAN! Still, I thought it was the best 4x game ever written. I bought Moo3... what's up with that? I bought Galactic Civilizations... and the Dark Avatars upgrade... (supposedly a new game) hoping for something with the same vision I had on 4X. WTF is a Real Time/Turned based system anyways? Sure, limit the turns, but I'll be dammed if I can think and react as fast as a computer! And if the game play is a month, shouldn't I get a month to think about my decisions. I'm up with turn based systems for this type of game!

My all time Favorite game is Alpha Centauri. Aaron, if you don't have a copy, email me, I've got 3! You could call that game Civilization 2.5. It had all the great elements of Civ 2, plus the best empire handling shortcuts, little features like being able to rename any thing that was text, and fracking VEHICLE/UNIT DESIGN. Sure, other games have those things now, but Space Empires V is the best I've seen (except for the text thingy).

I'm still waiting for Stragegy First to deliver my Boxed set, and running the Demo. Quit! 5 games so far, so looking to the forums. I see some bugs in the demo... but after reading the bug fixes for the full version, I'm not too worried (*and I'm running Vista OMG).

Back to topic, I was up here wondering wtf is up with Alliances? Me, ex-Infantry (17 years) disabled now, and I want to know wtf is up with Alliances in this game? Just cause two guys get together and agree to certain relations between themselves.... IT DOESN'T EXCLUED RELATIONS (together or apart, unless speciically agreed upon) WITH THE OTHER 120 NATIONS OUT THERE. Example: NATO. Because you're a member of NATO you can't trade with Turkey?, or NATO can't trade with Turkey? What kind of turkey bs is that. Must be fixed so Alliances, in agreement, can make treaties with other civs, or Alliances should be taken out of the game. One or other! Why, cause the concept is broken. Better then letting Alliances make treaties with non-allied powers would be also allowing individual members to have treaties with non-allied members (especially when not in contact with full alliance, wtf is up with that... oh the 'f' in my wtf means frack!) Ok, so I don't have the full version, and might be pissing up a flagpole, but this whole... not being able to treaty with a non-allied entity, especially AS THE ALLIANCE, is just plain wrong. Think of World War II and all the non-alligned powers who traded with partners to help us win!

Here's how I see it:
Simple Version: Alliances should be able to use all those pretty buttons to make treaties with non-allied civilizations, together. (Alliancce, eh?). If Vote fails so be it.
Complex Version: Alliance Members should be able to negotiate treaties with non-allied members that don't violate the "No Can Do" stipulations of the Alliance, Individually. If they accept treaties with non-allied parties that violate the agreements of the Alliance, well then a vote of 'No Confidence' (allowing the Alliance member to rectify the mistake), or 'Kick his Dumb Ass out!' sould come up in Alliance Chambers.

What I really think: Aaron knew what he was doing, but was rushed by the big boys to market, and has all this in mind. How do I know? Cause I've got more confidence in this game (then I ever had in Moo2 and Microprose/whoever in 10 years) in less then a week, just by reading and keeping my eyes open to the community and the (####deleted by big business censors####) of his efforts to make the game accessible to the players. Kudos!

Live On!
Casca
The Immortal Soldier

I agree, Alliances are currently no good but it doesn't really effect me so much because I just use the AI and then exterminate them. I realize some people like to try to win diplomatically but I'm a warmongerer. I'll treaty with you until I get all your tech or I'm strong enough to crush you, whichever comes first. This is for single player games, of course. For multiplayer sure it needs looking at pretty badly because that can cripple you, I would imagine.

It looks like forming treaties with alliances is bugged,
I've tried to set up treaties from the alliance menu that passed voting but I never see replies.

The non-alliance empires send me treaties between them and the alliance but I cannot accept them as a member, these don't show up in the alliance menu but in my empire messages.

note: this is in 1.71 with balance mod

I thought this was fixed? Are you sure it is still bugged?

~Myrath

Depends on the Alliance Terms. You need to take advantage of the votes per empire, and try to have more colonies than the other empire in the alliance; than you have political control of the rest of the alliance. If you can even get an empire to agree to an alliance, they are actually very useful.

Are you sure it's bugged? I was using them in 3.5!

i got a bug in the alliance (in balance mod), when i left the alliance i created (it was 6 CPUs strong), when i made treaties with other teams.. my "name" is the name of the alliance i made and left. It didnt come back to my original name.

Otherwise, alliances are kind of hard to break appart.. one of CPUs (Xiati) always wanted the terrans and some other out of it.. but everyone always voted no at that. I dont know if political sabotage can damage the bond between members of an alliance.. or if CPUs will ever leave one by themselves.

____________________________________________________

Without ammo, nice guns are just sophisticated clubs.

I did the horrible thing... I declared war to alliance, in which I am member of... Do not know what to wait))

I have a problem with alliances, too. In a stock 1.71 game, I am not a member of an alliance, but a trade and sensor,... pact with one of the (now) alliance members is still intact, even as it was forged before they entered the alliance. Now I am not able to change this pact (which also does not show up anywhere), and furthermore I can not get the alliance as a whole to agree to a new pact.