Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have? |
I'm not sure I see a use for the different damage types, has anyone found a good use for them? This list is from the Balance Mod, but I think the stock is the same:
Normal - Well duh...
Shields only - Good for use with boarding parties.
Skips normal shields - Starts damage immediatly, good weapon choice.
Skips all shields - Same but better than skips normal shields. But doesn't exist in game afaik.
Quad damage to shields - Gets through shields quickly.
Double damage to shields - Same.
Half (and 1/4) damage to shields - not useful but doesn't exist anyway, afaik.
Skips armor - Useful but the weapons that use it are a bit under powered imho so they are good early game but shields make them less useful, but still a good weapon choice.
Skips shields and armor - good choice in a weapon.
Here is where it gets sketchy:
Only Engines - but you have to get through armor and shields first? Does it damage armor and shields itself or do you need another weapon to get that job done? Even if it does, what use would an enemy ship be that had no engines? Good for boarding parties? Maybe missleships could keep beam ships at distance by destroying engines, but the playing field doesn't seem that large to take advantage.
Only Weapons - Same argument. Can it damage shields/armor itself or is another weapon needed? Is it worth the space this weapon takes up if I still have to get through all defences first?
Only Master Computers - Same. Does it also affect shields / armor? If I've got that far through their defences, why do I care about just the Master computer?
Only Shield Generators - Once I've got the enemy shields down, what do I care about the shield generator? Why waste the space?
Only boarding parties / Security Stations - assume good for taking over enemy ships?
Only planet destroyers - ? Same question.
Only population /resupply / Spaceports / Spaceyards / Plagues / Planet conditions. - Good for "terrorist" type bombardment with Drones? If they make it through the defences, could wreak havoc?
Push target / Pull target - good for getting enemy in range or keeping them at missle range? Worth the space?
Random Target movement - ?
Increase / disrupt weapon reload - Could be useful. Worth the space? What is the difference between the two?
Crew conversion - useful for that battle, but what happens at the end of the battle?
Kills crew - Skips Shields AND armor. Good for taking over ships? Can an enemy ship with no crew left still self destruct?
Deplete supplies - Well if they have no supplies, they can't fight, but is it worth the space taken? Can you get the enemy supplies down fast enough?
Timed remove experience - Is ship experience that big a deal to feel a need to negate it?
Shield implosion - Could be useful. Anyone use?
Energy Transfer - Isn't this kind of misnamed? It should be Shield Transfer, no? Anyone use?
Slow down - good for catching smaller/faster ships that are set to max range?
Timed control loss - Same as weapon disrupt?
Burn Armor - does it affect shields? If it does and then kills armor, then what? Is this THE weapon to use with the other specific destruction weapons like the Master Computer/shield generator/etc. weapons?
Thanks!
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
I tried random target movement once and it simply didn't work. Does it only work on fighters or something?
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
Well I did some reading, but the testing will have to wait until Saturday. I compared some of the "Only X" weapons and they stack up pretty well as far as damage, range and cost compared to regular weapons. Add in the bonus of skipping shields and you've got a good weapon.
But I still can't think of a use for them.
If I used, say, engine destroying defence satellites on my warp points, the enemy ships all might have no engines, but they would destroy all the satellies sitting there. Might be a nasty surprise that could cripple an enemy fleet and then just leave them there and by pass an enemy crippled fleet?
Maybe a mix? Have Cruisers or smaller ships with 1/2 Shield generator destroying missles and 1/2 close range beam weapons? Then the missles would destroy all the armor and the shield generator before the beam weapons come into play?
Or, 1/2 weapon destroying missles and 1/2 shield skipping beams?
Anyone tried any of them?
Also, what will a weapon do if its specific damage type is no longer available? Will an engine destroying weapon fire against an enemy with no engines or armor?
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
I can think of a few weapons that could use some of those damage types.
For example, the organic acid weapons. If they are acids, they should do hefty damage against stuff like ships, but be much weaker to shields, while the elecricity/lightning or plasma weapons from organic tech might make sense if damage was a little lower but they did extra damage to shields.
One energy beam from cystal tech (forget the name) gave me the impression it should do hit shields hard.
It would allow for some more strategy and tactics to occur.
For the pull/push target...
those are fun...
I found out just how fun they are when experimenting with tractor beams and short range yet high powered weapons on starbases...
a starbase design I only use in the space simulator has a few massive mount tractor beams, a few regular repulsor beams, and max range strategy...
ship catapult anyone?
Baseships are about the only thing not catapulted at least halfway across the map much of the time... (might need more tractor/repulsor beams for that feat)
It's funny watching some ships skidding sideways across the border of the map because of the momentum they've been imparted with.
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
The special damage types are good to have if you're trying to capture enemy vessels. They'll leave some of the target intact so you won't destroy it before the boarding parties seize control, and you won't have to spend as much time on repairs.
I've used repulsors on bases, and they work great against fighters. The little pests get pushed back out of their weapons' range. Should diminish the impact of drones as well.
I think there are new uses to be discovered for the other special weapons, but I haven't got around to all of them. And as a low/slow-tech player, I haven't yet seen a lot of things the game has to offer.
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
I had this idea too, but it turns out that all the repulsor beams target the drone or fighter in front, and all the rest hit you. So until they come up with better targeting strategies, I just put one repulsor on a ship at a time.
You know what would make tractors and repulsors a lot more fun, is if their range increased with level. Right now there's no reason to level up those weapons because they don't gain range and they don't seem to be able to push harder or heavier things. It could really be worth leveling them up if they could get to outrange weapons that deal damage. Then they could keep enemies out of your range or bring them into your range before they could hit you. And it wouldn't be unbalanced because the weapons themselves still don't deal damage.
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
In SE4, tractor beams could only pull smaller (maybe equal sized) targets. This might still be the case in SE5. If so, it would require hard code change to how the damage works; instead of being an arbitrary number, it could be the maximum tonnage of vehicle that could be pushed/pulled.
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
That would be another good way to do it. Give the tractor beams a useful range (like 200) right from the start, but make them only able to push fighters and satellites until you get up to about level 7.
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
long range be great, clean out sats from round planets without takn a scratch... nice
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
You'd still get scratched, because you'd be bringing the satellites into normal weapons range. That's why weapons that do damage would be broken with long range, but tractor beams and repulser beams wouldn't.
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
"only planet destroyers" would be useful if a large enemy fleet is escorting a planet destroyer. You can suicide attack it to destroy that component...
Or if they try to break through your lines with such an item, you can make sure it doesn't pass...
Saves your planets from going boom.
"Only master computer" is actually good. Why would you want it down? because a master computer is the bridge, life-support, and crew quarters all at one. You blow up that one component and the ship is dead in the water and completely uncrewed (so its easy to take over).
This is a one hit kill weapon, if the enemy uses a master computer, and if you get through his shields and armor first. It will be frightfully effective against a dreadnought.
A ship with shield depleters and armor eaters + master computer destroyer should be able to cripple dreadnoughts who make use of master computers.
In practice I will probably never use either, or any of the other special ones... They take too much space and are only effective against specific ship types. I would much rather just put on guns that can blow up EVERYTHING. Rather then worrying what type of stuff each individual enemy ship carries and how to take it out.
I do not have a Superman complex; for I am God, not Superman!
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
How effective would it be to put some of these special weapons on a drone, as support for a regular gun battle ship? The battle ship launches some drones, which throw out special attacks (engine destroying, loss of control attacks, shield/armor depleters, crew destruction, etc.), while the main ship closes for the kill.
Re: Weapon Damage types - What uses do they have?
In stock, the Only X types skip shields, but sadly do not skip armor. This makes their usage a little dubious, unless the enemy makes no use at all of armor.
In the Balance Mod, they penetrate armor at 90%, but do not skip shields. A little bit of damage is soaked by the armor, but the rest gets through to ravage the specific component type.
Random Target movement causes the target to be moved to a random location on the combat map. It can be quite effective for divide and conquer tactics.
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