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Home » news » forums » Support & Feedback » Scenarios & Mods » SE:V MODs

Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by Crian on Mon, 2007-09-03 23:16. SE:V MODs

Is it just me or is Space Empires 5 really, really slow? I have a Core 2 Duo E6400, a 256 MB GeForce 7600 GT with 1 GB of DDR2 RAM. I have the game patched to 1.44 with Balance Mod 1.09 and right now I can't play on galaxies bigger than small and more than 5 AIs because each player simply takes too long to make their turns (not to mention the processing afterwards...). Is this really how it is? Sometimes the turn processing takes even longer than my own turns, no kidding! I want to play huge, galaxy spanning epic games but I can't because the turns take sooooo long. It's that bad. Sad

I can play a host of other games but I really, really want this one. Any ideas? Thanks.

‹ BALANCE MOD: heavy hulls rebalance needed Bolt weapon displays ›
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Mod Designer

Re: Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by Fyron on Tue, 2007-09-04 02:49.

Find something to do during the downtime... Read a book, browse the web, etc.

Most of the last several major patch releases have had improvements to turn processing times; the biggest drain is still combat resolution, which sadly is not calculated at the speed of math. Rather, the game steps through the main combat engine at an accelerated pace (32x real time or something like that). Naturally, this has very strong diminishing returns from more powerful processors. :-\


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Re: Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by evilginger on Tue, 2007-09-04 03:47.

given that I can only manage 2-3 turns per day with a PBem game the speed of turn resolution is seldom the rate limiting step it human player speed

The single player game has got significantly faster but as Fyon says the gmae plays out all computer v computer battles as if they where strategic combats and does not use a calculation to do this as many games do.

Indeed many of the problems with the game are due to the fact that the AI empires are simulated players an approach I like but which tends to cause problems as its hard to get an AI to do what a human player can do any where as easly

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Re: Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by Crian on Tue, 2007-09-04 05:03.

Aaah, I see. Thanks for the replies.

Still, I'm used to other turn-based strategy games like Civ4 and GalCiv2 which finish their AI turns much faster. I know they handle combat much simpler but still it really prevents me from enjoying the game as much Sad. See I don't have that much time and I'm not the type who wants games to extend to weeks or even months! It's quite possible even for singleplayer games with 15 AI's on the hard setting on a huge galaxy given the loooong turns.

The reason I play singleplayer is primarily convenience, making this "feature", for me at least, highly unwelcome. Sad

Are they cooking up a way to improve on this? I really enjoy this game. A couple of days ago I was viciously beaten by the AI after a long, bloody war (our home systems were next to each other). I loved the experience but it was really tedious having to wait in between turns Sad. Yes I was browsing the web in between but when I play games I usually focus on playing so it's not something I'm comfortable with.

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Romulus68's picture
Mod Designer

Re: Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by Romulus68 on Tue, 2007-09-04 15:30.

This is always a tough trade off in 4X Strategy games. Do you want a faced paced game or one that offers a more in-depth game. How many times have you played a game with big battles that gives you a choice between you fighting it or the PC Auto-resolve. You sit there thinking if i control the fight I'll win while only loosing a few troops, but if i aut-resolve I may loose half or more of my forces. See, that is the computer making a dice roll or two with some percentages thrown in to determine victory and causualties.

I lean towards longer turns, but more realism. Again, its a trade off.

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Re: Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by Eater1 on Wed, 2007-09-05 17:59.

Erm, well, it may be a tradeoff in SE V, but that doesn't change the fact that the AI code takes way longer to run than it should. I suspect there is some corner-cutting going on under the covers there, which causes the AI turns to spin way more cycles than they should. There is no reason the relatively simplistic AI scripts just by themselves can't run at 10-100x the speed they do, there is something else going on back there.

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Mod Designer

Re: Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by Captain Kwok on Wed, 2007-09-05 18:37.

AI scripts are not the cause for long turn times - they are executed quite quickly. It's the movement phase (green bar) and combat phases (red bar) that contribute much more significantly to the processing time.

-----

Space Empires Depot | SE:V Balance Mod

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Re: Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by Eater1 on Fri, 2007-09-07 12:27.

So why does the movement phase take so long to run for the AI players? This is why I suggested there is corner-cutting going on - the movement takes time to process for the player, but I'm really hoping most of that is due to animations and visuals, there is no reason it shouldn't be near-instant for the computer players, provided the renderer is completely switched off (which I am REALLY hoping it is) and the relevant data structures are updated intelligently and not any more than necessary. Sure, you may not get the same pretty abstractions if you do AI movement properly, but people playing the game don't care how nice your abstractions are if the computers take 5 or 10 minutes to make their turns.
Battles, OK, I can understand - if you really want to simulate real-time battles properly, run the battles at 32x speed, which I think is what we get now. At the 3 min time limit, each battle should take a maximum of about 6 seconds, which is reasonable, though still a tad long. However, it's the long movement phases which really get me.

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Mod Designer

Re: Is the game really this slow?

Submitted by Fyron on Fri, 2007-09-07 14:42.

Even without visuals, there is still a fair amount of stuff to calculate as each ship moves... Cutting corners would involve not calculating sight radii with every hex moved, and instead skipping it all and just calculating sight after the ship is done moving. Given the AI's tendency to move single ships around, there are a lot of calculations to perform.


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