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Home » news » forums » Support & Feedback » Scenarios & Mods » SE:V MODs

IRM : Update.

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Wed, 2007-02-28 16:19. SE:V MODs

I'm nearly done with an altered version of the purchasing system. I had to give up making something brand new as the amount of rewriting was enormous and could not get the motivation to do it. So i got back to my old system, but fixed everything that was broken. I also tried to reduce the amount of lines in the code so it's easier to read and modify.

On a second note, i plan on streamlining the names of the designs the AI uses. Too many long winded and redundant names, probably difficult to know what is what when looking at AI's design list. I will try to make them follow the same names the Player uses, or at least similar ones.

‹ Extreme Planets Colonization Death explosion ›
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Mod Designer

Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Fyron on Wed, 2007-02-28 18:26.

Will it include FQM beta 5? I finally got around to actually spelling out the license and credit info. Eye-wink

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Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Wed, 2007-02-28 18:48.

Fyron wrote:
Will it include FQM beta 5? I finally got around to actually spelling out the license and credit info. ;)

Well, it will include the latest of your betas Smiling. But i made sure my mod had no conflict with yours so it's just a pasting files over issue...

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Psieye's picture

Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Psieye on Wed, 2007-02-28 19:49.

Ahaha, and we're (most probably) mere days away from v1.30 when even more AI functions get released.

---Sig---
Playing Touhou games (Go here if interested . No, nobody else is that good/insane as that replay). No rush for SE V bug fixing.

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Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by gnosis on Wed, 2007-02-28 20:09.

hmm.. where is the 1.30 changelog then?

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Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Wed, 2007-02-28 20:22.

Psieye wrote:
Ahaha, and we're (most probably) mere days away from v1.30 when even more AI functions get released.

I haven't said any release date for my mod though. I wrote that update to show i still work on my mod, even though i haven't done much in the last 2 weeks. But now that i have started again, the boulder will keep rolling. The worst thing for me is when i stop working on my project, it takes me a lot of energy to restart it. My inertia is building up again Smiling.

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Psieye's picture

Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Psieye on Wed, 2007-02-28 20:43.

gnosis wrote:
hmm.. where is the 1.30 changelog then?
2 days away, judging from previous experience.

---Sig---
Playing Touhou games (Go here if interested . No, nobody else is that good/insane as that replay). No rush for SE V bug fixing.

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My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Mon, 2007-03-05 17:05.

I found why my purchasing system was so buggy since 1.25. Some bug in 1.25 prevented it from counting colonies. This screwed the whole algorithm that was colony count heavy. I fixed it now, but i also changed how it works, using some ideas from Kwoks new purchase system. But mine works differently though, i don't use "demand" system, it would not have worked well with my huge number or design types.

My new purchase system also make use of unused production. I found a way to make the AI queue up more than one item, while not over-queuing. So my AI can build more than one ship a turn, or combine ship with unit building, or facilities with units. Still have to work out the weighting, but the basis works. I also included the scrapping scripts of Kwok, but i will have to revise it a bit as i think it scrap units too soon and don't check if they are actually obselete (it just check the age).

On the bugs front, i found a big one in the script that made satellites. I had a duplicate entry that checked for a weapon that did not exist, preventing the design from being completed. I also made another script cleaning and started to add comments (better late than never). My scripts are a mess, i pitty thoses that tryied to use my code as basis. But i'm fixing this, the next release of my scripts will be cleaner and more documented.

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Captain Kwok's picture
Mod Designer

Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Captain Kwok on Mon, 2007-03-05 19:48.

Actually the first condition for unit scrapping is if the design is obsolete and then by how old it is.

-----

Space Empires Depot | SE:V Balance Mod

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Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Mon, 2007-03-05 21:39.

Captain Kwok wrote:
Actually the first condition for unit scrapping is if the design is obsolete and then by how old it is.

Well, i should check it again, but it seemed to me it wasn't checking if it was obselete. Well, i did not spent much time on this, i might have read it wrong...

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Psieye's picture

Re: My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by Psieye on Tue, 2007-03-06 10:26.

It is good to hear you found the bug. Kwok, I take it v1.31 will have that fixed given it seems like a script parser bug?

Fallen Haven wrote:
My new purchase system also make use of unused production. I found a way to make the AI queue up more than one item, while not over-queuing. So my AI can build more than one ship a turn, or combine ship with unit building, or facilities with units.
This is very pleasing news indeed. I take it to mean though, that we still don't know how to make it build more than 1 facility per turn? Still, knowing that it can build other stuff while waiting for the next facility to be ready is reassuring.

---Sig---
Playing Touhou games (Go here if interested . No, nobody else is that good/insane as that replay). No rush for SE V bug fixing.

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Re: My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Tue, 2007-03-06 12:39.

Psieye wrote:
It is good to hear you found the bug. Kwok, I take it v1.31 will have that fixed given it seems like a script parser bug?

Well, if this is going to be fixed, it's good news.

Quote:
This is very pleasing news indeed. I take it to mean though, that we still don't know how to make it build more than 1 facility per turn? Still, knowing that it can build other stuff while waiting for the next facility to be ready is reassuring.

It's more useful for the AI to get extra units/ships than it is to finish a planet infrastructure. But the AI can queue more than one structure, but it need a lot of resources to spare for that, i noticed facilities drain a lot of it when they are queued (surely a bug).

I might release a new version before the next patch as it is. This won't fix all the AI's issues but it should do a lot better than 0.8c...

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Psieye's picture

Re: My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by Psieye on Tue, 2007-03-06 13:03.

Fallen Haven wrote:
Psieye wrote:
It is good to hear you found the bug. Kwok, I take it v1.31 will have that fixed given it seems like a script parser bug?

Well, if this is going to be fixed, it's good news.

I view this as a damn critical bug that shouldn't be all that hard for Aaron to fix given he has almost a week before the 'release date' of the next public patch.

Quote:
I might release a new version before the next patch as it is. This won't fix all the AI's issues but it should do a lot better than 0.8c...
Mmm, that may not be a bad idea though I find myself without time to play until... at least 20 March and I know I'm going to be given an extra workload (an Actual Project!) by then. Ah but marking should be over too, so it'll balance out...

But hey, I'm just one player. Many others eagerly await something to sink their teeth into. Afterall, you'll need time once v1.31 comes out to adjust your scripts to take advantage of all the new script functions. Do remember to keep a back-up of older versions (ask people for them if need be) just to check whether it's your work or a new public patch's fault when something abysmal happens like v1.25 did to your AI.

---Sig---
Playing Touhou games (Go here if interested . No, nobody else is that good/insane as that replay). No rush for SE V bug fixing.

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Re: My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by evilginger on Tue, 2007-03-06 13:41.

Good to hear this and 8d would be nice but don’t rush it especially as you are probably going t o have to update shortly there after when 1.3x comes out.

Thinking about it is more common to build multiple ships or units per turn than it is facilities as a human player so that if the AI cant do it puts it at less of a disadvantage than building one mine or troop per turn when a human player could build ten under the same circumstances. Even ships would not be that much of a disadvantage as you tend to get a lot more of five ships built in four turns than multiple ships per turn as ship construction “cost” tends to rise in line with a planets construction “rate”, so this relation remains fairly constant.

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Re: My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Tue, 2007-03-06 16:21.

evilginger wrote:
Thinking about it is more common to build multiple ships or units per turn than it is facilities as a human player so that if the AI cant do it puts it at less of a disadvantage than building one mine or troop per turn when a human player could build ten under the same circumstances. Even ships would not be that much of a disadvantage as you tend to get a lot more of five ships built in four turns than multiple ships per turn as ship construction “cost” tends to rise in line with a planets construction “rate”, so this relation remains fairly constant.

Well, when i play, i tend to queue up several ships at once as to not have to check my build queues every turns. My new script make the AI manage it's build rate better and net let them idle as much as it would in stock. The improvement especially help when the AI has only a few colonies.

Btw, i found out that the AI don't seem to send it's fleet anywhere right now. I double checked the code, fixed a few things but the AI don't seem to attack. Is this another stupid bug introduced in 1.25? I'm sure my AI was capable of attacking before 1.25...

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Re: My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by evilginger on Tue, 2007-03-06 18:16.

Quote:
Fallen Haven

Btw, i found out that the AI don't seem to send it's fleet anywhere right now. I double checked the code, fixed a few things but the AI don't seem to attack. Is this another stupid bug introduced in 1.25? I'm sure my AI was capable of attacking before 1.25...

It was though I am not sure when it stoped doing this I am sure it did attack in 0.54 & 0.6.I think it was some time in 0.7 that the problem started when as you said yourself you rather nerf'd your own AI that and its continued to be the same in 0.8 so far. I will say the AI in 0.8 is quite good at defending better than 0.7

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Henk Brouwer's picture

Re: My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by Henk Brouwer on Wed, 2007-03-07 02:21.

I also ran into this in my current game, I play with the AI on high bonus, so my neighbours, the Terrans, should be far stronger than me, but they are simply not attacking.
Currently I am attacking their homesystem with a fleet of 13 ships, and I have already conquered several worlds. they have a 30 ship fleet in the same system parked on their homeworld but it isn't doing anything (I know their ships are technologically superior too). They do not appear to use their fleet for attack, nor for defense (freeing blockaded worlds etc) I do not know what the problem is, maybe it has to do something with retrofitting of ships? I could not find clear evidence of this though.

Also in the current year 2403.4, they have only send scouts to 3 systems beyond their own, which leaves them with allmost no worlds to colonize (I have visited 16 systems). (since two of those are my systems)

I could send you the savegame.

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Re: My new purchase system works now...

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Wed, 2007-03-07 03:29.

Henk Brouwer wrote:
I also ran into this in my current game, I play with the AI on high bonus, so my neighbours, the Terrans, should be far stronger than me, but they are simply not attacking. Currently I am attacking their homesystem with a fleet of 13 ships, and I have already conquered several worlds. they have a 30 ship fleet in the same system parked on their homeworld but it isn't doing anything (I know their ships are technologically superior too). They do not appear to use their fleet for attack, nor for defense (freeing blockaded worlds etc) I do not know what the problem is, maybe it has to do something with retrofitting of ships? I could not find clear evidence of this though.

Also in the current year 2403.4, they have only send scouts to 3 systems beyond their own, which leaves them with allmost no worlds to colonize (I have visited 16 systems). (since two of those are my systems)

I could send you the savegame.

Well, i believe the bug is one that was introduced in 1.25, not something i can fix. From what i understand, the AI uses lists that it generate over time to know what to attack. But thoses lists seem to be broken with the patch. I ran many tests since i fixed the purchase system (in my current build) and the AI seem to scout a few systems then suddently stops for no reason i can find. The current version is full of bugs, even if i can fix them they might get broken again by the next patch.

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I believe i figured out the last show stopper bug...

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Fri, 2007-03-09 09:21.

In previous versions, i started adding task forces to the AI fleets. It seemed harmless at first, there was only 2 and the second one would be created as soon as a supply ship would come around. The problem is, the fleet won't move until all TFs have something in them. In 0.8c, there are several TFs to be created. That's why a fleet of over 30 ships stay idling while the empire is being destroyed. So the solution for now is to remove theses extra TFs until i figure a way to create them on a need them basis...

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Henk Brouwer's picture

Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Henk Brouwer on Fri, 2007-03-09 11:41.

Good news. can't wait to see the next version

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Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Benji on Fri, 2007-03-09 11:43.

Hey,

I got this game a couple of months ago but I put of playing till (at least) the next patch. Anyway, while browsing the forums I came across this mod. So what is it? I couldn't find a home page or something with a description of it.. and the name being IRM isn't very informative either Smiling

Thanx

Benji

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Re: IRM : Update.

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Fri, 2007-03-09 11:51.

Benji wrote:
Hey,

I got this game a couple of months ago but I put of playing till (at least) the next patch. Anyway, while browsing the forums I came across this mod. So what is it? I couldn't find a home page or something with a description of it.. and the name being IRM isn't very informative either Smiling

Thanx

Benji

That's because IRM is meant for the initiated only Smiling. Seriously, i have a readme for it in the 0.8c thread. But since i have an FTP now for it, i will provide a link in my signature along the next version of it. But to make things short, my mod is a conversion of the stock game, wich change a lot of things from technologies to the AI. It's still a work in progress though, it's still in beta stage.

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Next version will be 0.9a...

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Wed, 2007-03-14 14:37.

The changes has been extensive. The purchase system has been greatly improved, the upgrading bug fixed and the AI design names are being changed. Having help with coding and bug hunting has put the mod on second gear. At the rate it's going, we might have a new version before the end of this week.

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Re: Next version will be 0.9a...

Submitted by evilginger on Wed, 2007-03-14 14:54.

Good to hear, have you adjusted the initial priority of building colony ships as I still feel 8e could do with a boost to this is if only for the first fifty turns. It would also be good if ministers and the Ai had some concept of distance as they have a habit of rushing into new but unknown areas. Just get two to exchange maps and watch the colony ships stream to wards that area dodging nearer targets. The targets they chose might have better value but being miles away from the core of the empire leads to over expansion which has its down side even if its just that the target is already colonised by some one else.

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Re: Next version will be 0.9a...

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Wed, 2007-03-14 15:07.

evilginger wrote:
Good to hear, have you adjusted the initial priority of building colony ships as I still feel 8e could do with a boost to this is if only for the first fifty turns. It would also be good if ministers and the Ai had some concept of distance as they have a habit of rushing into new but unknown areas. Just get two to exchange maps and watch the colony ships stream to wards that area dodging nearer targets. The targets they chose might have better value but being miles away from the core of the empire leads to over expansion which has its down side even if its just that the target is already colonised by some one else.

Yep, just added that to the "to do" list. But for the colonizer issue, i made the AI not build too many at once so it has some time to build up it's colonies before trying to get more. Having many fledging colonies is crippling for the AI, and it's very difficult for it to defend them so they are easy grab for a human player... But it's not hard in stone yet, might change it later on when the AI gets stronger...

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Re: Next version will be 0.9a...

Submitted by evilginger on Wed, 2007-03-14 15:14.

I sort of agree with that but it might be worth trying a bit of an early colony rush on large maps where it will generaly take some time before any one runs into any one else.

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IRM 0.9a

Submitted by Fallen Haven on Mon, 2007-03-19 21:46.

The next IRM should be out this week. We are currently rooting out bugs that we created while trying to revamp the script, but they should be ironed out soon.

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Re: Next version will be 0.9a...

Submitted by Brad on Tue, 2007-03-20 16:38.

Fallen Haven wrote:
Having many fledging colonies is crippling for the AI, and it's very difficult for it to defend them so they are easy grab for a human player... But it's not hard in stone yet, might change it later on when the AI gets stronger...

No reason you can't do both, depending on the aggressiveness of the empire.

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