This is not Star Trek

I know that there will be a Starwars shipset soon and I know that there are Startrek shipsets for SE4 but not SE5, look around fan sites, im sure there is one.

http://www.spaceempires.net has much mods and shipsets for SEIV and people there are woking on mods for SEV.

atrocities had a star trek mod for SEIV but he won´t convert it to SEV (i already asked him).
but he said some people from the spacempires.net community are working on a new star trek mod.

You can't simply convert an SEIV shipset to SEV. SEIV used 2d bitmap/jpg (i can't remember which) images for ships. SEV is completely 3d. There are many startrek models available for download so the battle is 1/2 way won. Someone will still need to sit down and sort out the textures and txt files to get them to work ingame however.

Your lord and master (below Foamy) LordHavoc

The ships in SEV look beautiful. But they are much harder to create. So, it will take more time before all the SEIV shipsets are moved over to SEV. Fortunately, SEV attracts a number of extremely talented folks. Though it will take longer, we'll still get them, and they will look quite awesome, I think.

I got the klingon ships almost done and I have been working on the borg ships. It takes along time to get them right and working in game.

"Submitted by jsm64 on Tue, 2006-12-05 20:06.
I got the klingon ships almost done and I have been working on the borg ships. It takes along time to get them right and working in game."

Any chance of sharing the files ?

Necromancer3 has done a Federation set and we are trying to get it available for everybody. If you have the Klingons done that would be great.

Well i'm working on a Klingon AI system. Agressive, Slower ship designs with more weapons. Trying to get the cloaking to happen correctly..

Look, its a Star Trek shipset!

Downloaded, and installing now... The models look descent (did a quick view of them in the Direct3D X Viewer), so I have high hopes! Thanks for the link!

guys,

jsm64 has almost completed a Klingon ship set as of 12/5.

Grelvis Is working on a Klingon AI and is almost done as of 12/28.

Necromancer3 has completed the Federation set and posted it already is talking about doing Klingons next.

Can you guys get together and share what you have done and make a really awsome Klingon race ? Instead of having you all work in isolation ? Please ?

Necromancer3 has been posting in the "Star Trek ships ?" thread under the SEV modding section

Yeah, well... Just make sure you ASK permission from these modelers before you go ripping off their work and posting it here for D/L. I'll be happy to rain on everyone's parade that doesn't include proper credits. I'm a modeler and I've had some of my models swiped and the credits changed to someone else after they shaded a texture here or there a bit lighter or darker. Pisses the hell out of modelers when peeps take credit for the hours and hours of time they put in to make them. A common courtesy request and proper credits is all that's needed...

Is there a mod viewer for the 3D model type that SEV uses so when I D/L a shipset I can use the model viewer to look at them all?

I just checked the readme file for this mod from Necromancer3 and he lists the following credits:

Thanks Go to:

Interplay
Taldren
Chris Jones
Pneumonic81
JST Online and the SOA Homeworld Mod Team.

I find this credit list insultingly short. Each model needs to be given proper credit. They arn't all done by the same modeler. I know this matters little to those that just want to use them, and it's a simpler matter still for adding the shipset, using it and enjoying these models, but it's a disservice to those that spent countless hours making them for you. Something most people won't care about, but something that needs to be done is ACCURATELY giving proper credit to the modeler for his/her model.

Every shipset author needs to respect the time the modelers put into their work and at least show the minimum respect and give detailed and proper credits.

I consider NOT doing this the same as taking SEV and offering it as a free D/L on Torrent. It's theft and websites like SpaceEmpires.net shouldn't condone it and host the shipset D/L if the models were ripped from someone else and credit not given to them.

Try the utilities folder. Not sure how it works though.
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

Dizzy, about the credits...

A) that would be better handled via PMs;

B) While there definatly appear to be two differen't sets there -- one "dark" and one "light" -- that doesn't necessarily mean there are 2 different authors (though it does detract from the shipset).

edit: C) He could have had permission to handle credits in that manner.
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

Shipset authors just need to be aware that EACH INDIVIDUAL model is painstakenly crafted and some may not be by the same author. So credits need to be SPECIFIC for each and every model included in a set. Otherwise, before you know it, shipset authors will take bits here and there from other shipsets already done, insert them with others and before you know your credit list is completely jumbled and inaccurate.

If Shipset authors are gonna be careless like that then we will end up seeing a black market of shipsets. And that wont be any fun.

Dizzy, a slippery slope argument is not generally accepted for a very good reason.

If the entire reason you're complaining about the vagueness of the credits (which were about the norm for such things anyway) is because it MIGHT end up leading to no credits being given... you need to step back. Waaaaay back.

Edit:

And before you try and tell me about how much it hurts to have your work stolen, I've had it happen to me (I'm a writer)! It was a mistake on the credits, but its happened.
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

I'm sorry that the credits are to vague for you, since I cannot name the author of each model that created it for the SOA mod, nor will I use Pneumonic81's real name, I will take actions to correct this. On the next release of the shipset, Pneumonic81's Constitution will be replaced by the Taldren Version, the BB and DN models will also be replaced by stock Taldren SFC models. I understand the issue of giving proper credit where credit is due (as a programmer I have had people take credit for the code I created), hence the reason I created a readme, I wanted everyone to know I did not create any of these models... I never claimed to. I think you should be aware that this is the FIRST time I've ever released anything to anyone and was fairly nervous about doing it just barely remembering to create the readme. (had to re-create the .rar file twice to include the readme...)Once I have the shipset so that EVERYONE (hopefully you as well) will like it I will release it again, but be aware I WILL NOTlist every artist that worked at Taldren while SFC2 and SFC:OP were being made... But I will give Props to Taldren and Interplay.

Thanks and I hope this doesn't upset anyone,

Necromancer

Well, if I step back it will be only to put my boot up your you know where.

Now, I feel I'm a slightly intelligent bloke and can add 2 and 2 and get 4... but for the life of me I can't see your side of the argument adding up at all whereas you'd even have anyone consider condoning an incomplete readme and chalk it up to a 'deal with it' attitude.

Don't bother trying to explain it to me. You'll NEVER convince me to look the other way and be silent when shipsets start getting sloppy and omit an authors name for a model that's been ripped. And that I think is all I have to say to you.

Thanks Necromancer for doing it the right way. You know, the original SFC2EAW models were done by Taldren and Interplay. Rick Knox didn't step into the ring for Taldren till SFCOP came out and then only the Xship designs. Thanking the taldren/interplay team is plenty when using the game's stock models. It's the custom jobs done after that that I'm worried about... but it's kinda hard to find anything made too late after that that will have few enough polys to run well... Seems modelers started ramping up the polys big time. Seen any of the latest from Wicked Zombie, omg.

Anyway, all I'm saying as you already said is that a readme including all the names of the authors for the models they did be included. That's it!

Feel free to try, anyday. I get the impression your not someone to anger lightly.... recognize the reverse, please.

My side of the argument boiled down to "You don't KNOW the models were done by two differen't people (unless you had evidence I wasn't aware of)" (Note: the fact that later evidence (admissions by the auther) proved your right doesn't count to negate that arguement) and "calling foul because credits weren't done on a model-by-model basis is ridiculous, especially if its just because you think that'll lead to giving no credit".

Let me give you a hint: Many people have tried to tell me to shut up. Success on the other hand, is nowhere NEAR as common.

This is compounded by the fact that I like to argue... and I feel that the best way to resolve differences is try to understand eachothers arguements because the truth is probably in between. And you're opponents failure to understand your position is (usually) half your fault for not making it clear.
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

Oh, and Fyron, editing your post while I'm quoting it is REALLY irritating!

Hence my point about the (in)validity of slippery slope arguements.
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

I was going to edit it again!

Giving credit and copyright information for the game the models are borrowed from is more than sufficient. It's not even necessary or purposeful to copy the list of artists or whatever from the game's credits info...

Nooooooooooooo! I was lucky I caught the first edit via my mistaken hitting of the "preview" button!

Albiet, that said, its not like I would have had much to add past "good arguement" which I owuldn't bother adding normally...
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

I speak from experience here. Trust me when I say that if models start appearing here from authors that are not getting a readme credit or have asked their models not be used with out permission and they are, then you will see flames all over these boards. It won't be fun. Besides, we are talking about 3D models. Anyone can take a 2D picture of one and use the pic in SEIV without raising any feathers. But you use the model itself then we are talking two different things.

Agreed, Fryon. I stated the same above. Perhaps you misunderstood me. I am talking about crediting those modelers whoose individual models are not included in games from Taldren/Interplay in games such as but not limited to SFC1,2;EAW/OP,3. I'm sure you agree that it wouldn't be right or acceptable to take a 3D model, from say me, and use it in a mod without using my name in the credits.

I'm using them in a game right now. I noticed some "non-model" text in the Lt Cruiser image? Like 5 letters upside down.

Aside from balance issues, I hope the Klingon Ships are bigger, class by class, then the Fed ships. Cause Klingons like armor and guns. They'll give up a little speed and science equipment for more GUNS!!! In a stand up fight, a Klingon Battle Cruiser is more than a match for any Fed Battle ship. In a running fight, its going to be different. Those tricky Feds, always running behind planets and into clouds and such.

Backbone. I respect that.

Shipset authors shouldnt use models that dont have credits. Period. (I dont see this as a problem that'd hinder shipset authors from whipping out shipsets as most models some 95% all have a credit readme attached.) The readme credits for each model are quite clear in who is responsible for what. A simple cut and paste into the new SEV folder's readme for credit reference is simple, easy and to be expected.

Hehe, good hint. You seem a worthy adversary. I hope not to have to fight you on the battlefield.

You're moving into the region of modding and not shipsets.
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

Good, so do I (Actually, more along the lines of I just don't get that most people DON'T have one and have trouble backing down because of it)

OK, again: Credits were given at the bottom to varius people. I'm lost, whats teh issue.

Good.... because something I forgot to mention is I have a (self-acknowledged) issue with not backing down.

Not good... because I like to argue

edit: Mising quote box broke the thread. Edit: OK, two quote boxes.
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

Let me be specific. If another shipset designer uses an existing shipset with an Excelsior, and a Connie, each by a different author but decides only to use the Connie, the credits must be specific for each model, otherwise credit may be given to a modeler whoose model is not even in the shipset... or worse, the author isnt listed and someone else is.

Pretty simple I think.

Are we splitting hairs now?

So you're sayign that credit must be given by model because otherwise the author MIGHT slip up, eventually?
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

Yes.

Then you're being ridiculous, and treading perilously close to the fallacy of the slippery slope.

Edit:

And just to be clear, complaining simply because someone MIGHT make a mistake in the future is why its ridiculous.
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

Amusing as it is to watch this argument I realy think we have a troll with a obsesion with copyright and one should not on principle feed trolls.

Grr... I have a hard time with not feeding trolls, they're just so cute and cuddly
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There are 10 types of people in the world:

Those that understand binary, and those that don't.

Whatever. I'm not arguing to be right and force my opinion. I'm a modeler myself. What did you expect after the 1st link to the ST Shipset http://www.spaceempires.net/home/downloads-details-585-Federation_TMP_Shipset.html#dldetails that says:

I doubt my work will show here unless someone runs my models thru a poly reducer 4 or 5 times. But that's beside the point. The point is someone should speak up for the modelers and be the voice before it becomes a major problem, as you can see it has already become one. I'll stfu now and tell you I told you so when modelers catch wind they're getting ripped off on this forum and others and flame your guys away... It's not pretty and I'm only trying to help. I certainly want to be able to use new 3D shipsets... but that's gonna be hard to do when a modeler claims it's been ripped from him and is demanding it be taken down...

I'm not gonna bother with this thread anymore. It has little visibility for my purpose and I'll make it a point to restate what I've already said in a more friendly concise and clear manner elsewhere.

a star trek mod would be fine! so we have BotF II

Well re-writting alot of the AI code takes most of my spare time. Not planning anything else so far... It would be nice to have a full working mod, but thats a while off i think. Overall AI performance is more inportant for me..

Would Literaly ROFL exept I dont have the room

needed that rubish day

cheered me up no end

How nice of you to skip the last section there.
"See included Readme for thanks to everyone that created models.""

As much as I wanted to be done with this thread... Nothing was skipped. The readme is insufficient and I addressed this already. I wont further respond to this sort of commentary when posters do not read this thread in its entirety. Please dont be ignorant and obtuse here. This is a serious issue.

The point is that its cobbled together? Fine. The WORST this situation credits is crediting someone too many times. Such a huge issue.

If the readme is what you're talking about, quote THAT. Don't quote a non-relevant link page that just says see the readme for details.

So how are your Shipsets coming along. Think i'm done with the Klingon AI for now, just fine tuning the research pathways. Currently can't give the AI orders to Cloak ships, so i'll have to revisit this area. Ship orders is still the main area i wan't to address. Want the AI to return to a defended Warp Point in force. Of cource, if they could cloak, they could still slip by with a single ship.

Will there be a Star Trek mod, or just a series of shipsets for use in the current stock or modded games?

I'm sure someone will eventually make a Star Trek mod.

-----

Space Empires Depot | SE:V Balance Mod

You could always make your own ST mod.

LOL. I wish. I'm nowhere near as experience as most of you at tinkering with this stuff. Just a loyal fan, enjoying the fruits of your labors.

If anyone is working on a mod, and I can offer some help in any way, I'd be glad to. But I don't even know where to begin to mod.

Okay, let me list to you my experence before beginning my Shipset

:
I recieved CAD classes
I knew Creating 3d Models was possible
I heard Google Sketchup works similar to how CAD works

Now, Almost 2 weeks later, I am making significant progress on making my shipset. I have learned tons, and all by trial and error and the occasional "Help! What is this!" message.

Start modding, ask for help from more experenced people, and keep working on it. Experence doesn't matter, just time and Drive. Sometimes just drive is enough since you can steal time when you are supposed to be sleeping

Klingon AI

Heghlu'meH QaQ jajvam

( Today is a good day to die.)

With the warp drive function working, is anyone going to implement the changes into a star trek mod...and is there one? this is an old thread, but its worth asking

There are allso, at this time, just enough Star Trek shipsets to make a working Star Trek: The Next Generation mod with.

Dizzy: To clear things up, as I somewhat understand your unvoiced question:

Your complaint boils down to the following. Rillbur, this is what he's really saying behind his Trollish facade.

"I don't care about the Taldren models credits, they're Taldren. What I want, is for this [list of modellers' names here], to be matched up with this [list of non-Taldren Models here] so that everyone will know who did which non-Taldren model."

Now then, I don't know why you're being so un-repentingly anal about it.
I allso don't care. Every time you've posted so far, it has come out as Flame Bait. As internet veterans know, Flame Bait = Drama. We do not want your Drama.

From now on, state the exact complaint you have. Don't try to make it sound smarter, or dumber. That leads to confusion for all.
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I'll make one later.

You do realize of course that that question you were answering, and the post you were trying to flame, were almost 16 months old. I think we all now know where the Borg shipsets are and that Dizzy was flame baiting. Drama, indeed...

How entertaining!!!! FlaMiNg n00bs are vEryYyY FuNnY AnD SuPeR DeLIciOuSS!@!@#!@!@!@!@!

and how can i leave without posting star trek??

Not flaming anyone b-spud just providing a much needed reality check. Awesome smilies you have there.